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Mangesh Hattikudur
One Bada** Debate (we need your vote)
by Mangesh Hattikudur - December 12, 2007 - 11:36 AM

sponge0707.jpgJason and I like to run a clean site. We scrub our posts of 4-letter words, and have bars of soap at the ready for any potty mouths around the office. And for the most part there are easy replacements. Our good friend Roget has quick fixes for most swears and curses, and a thumb through the thesaurus generally provides seamless solutions. But here’s our question: Should we be allowed to use the word badass in posts? There’s a certain attitude to the word that seems distinct. Plus, Thesaurus.com comes up shamefully short on replacements. Take a look for yourself:

agent provocateur, agitator, bad actor, dog, gremlin, heel, hellion, incendiary, inciter, inflamer, instigator, knave, loose cannon, meddler, mischief-maker, nuisance, phony, punk, rabble-rouser, rascal, recreant, rogue, smart aleck, snake, stormy petrel, weasel, wise guy

So what should we do? When you want to talk about Louis Armstrong’s statement against Eisenhower, or Miles Davis’ refusal to go on as a warm up act for Steve Miller, that 6-letter word seems so perfect. Plus, “gremlin” and “stormy petrel” just won’t do.

So readers, should we use it or not? Should we stick to the asterisks? And what replacement would you choose for a title like 6 Bada** Quakers You Need to Know. Leave your arguments in the comments and we’ll tally ‘em up and decide.

Comments (90)
  1. Ah, go ahead and use it – but you should surround it with unecessary “quotes”!!

  2. Use as needed.

  3. Your problem here is that thesaurus entry is for the noun form of badass, whereas your examples of use on the site are adjectival uses. With a little creative poking around Roget’s brain, my guess is that you guys can do better than a couple asterisks. And word to JaneM’s comment about quotation marks.

  4. I think “badass” is a touchy subject when it comes to swear words. Having the word “ass” in it makes it a swear, but coupled with the word “bad” the meaning is something good. IMO I don’t care either way.

    The question is, would others feel more comfortable with “bada$$” or “bada**”? Also, if you guys and the website decide to take the super-sensitive route, a good synonym that is not listed in the thesaurus is “awesomely bad”. I think that would be a suitable substitution that conveys awesomeness of their badness… their “badass-ed-ness”.

  5. Ultimately, who gives a rat’s ***?

  6. I don’t really think of ass as a swear anyway, but as it is a negitive word I could see some finding it objectional. Badass being a positive term though I say go for it!

  7. Use it.

  8. I have no problem with badass, or really, with any cussing. A good possible compromise might be to use *** or $$ in titles of posts (since they’re larger) and then leave it uncensored in the body of the post. I guess it wouldn’t really make that much difference, though.

    But gremlin just doesn’t cut it!

  9. Does it really matter? I think it would be a waist of time to try to censor. After all if I were to say “Samuel L Jackson was a real badass in Pulp Fiction” would it really be any different then stating “Samuel L Jackson was a real bada$$ in Pulp Fiction”? To me its ridiculous if you use $$ instead of SS your are not changing the meaning of what you are trying to say nor does present a differant image because you don’t use profanity.

  10. I’d say use it, but definitely without the astericks. Writing badass and bada** is the same thing – even though you replaced ’ss’ with ‘**’, it will be read as ‘badass’ not ‘bada-asterick-asterick’, so why bother? It’s the same type of thing that is done on TV more and more these days – someone says something ‘naughty’ and it’s bleeped out, and it stands up to the FCC’s moral code. But most of the time, any idiot can figure out what the bleeped out word is from the context of what wasn’t bleeped out – so it’s like the bleep wasn’t even there…

    bleep
    :)

  11. Since it is Christmas time I am compelled to mention that Mary rode Joseph’s a$$ all the way to Bethlehem.

  12. I was a bit flummoxed when I first glimpsed bada** on the page. I’m thinking, Sopranos. I favor the vowel *, as in Bad*ss, for clarity.

  13. Honestly, I don’t see a problem with the word “ass”. Of course, I’m pretty numb to profanity anyway. The only word I strongly object to is the dreaded “f- word”.

    And if you are going to allow it, leave out the “**”. I agree, it does not change the meaning of the word. Unless you’re trying to get around Google, I say leave the s’s!!

  14. Although I could less whether or not you use a** or a$$ or any other variation (@$$ comes to mind), my greatest fear is the Internet Nazis here at work will slap a Vulgar Site label on mentalfloss thus putting an end to my lack of productivity.

  15. I always thought censorship was ridiculous (other commenters explained it well, I don’t need to keep going with it), but I like the fact that the site is clean because I read the site at work and the web security blocks anything with even a little profanity (I can’t believe it let a page with so many “asses” through!

    I’ve grown so accustomed to this being a profanity-free zone that when I read the post title I assumed “Bada” was something obscure I’ve never heard of and “**” was going to lead to a footnote explaining it!

  16. I love you guys, but if you have to ask permission to use the word, you probably aren’t one.

  17. I say use it, just don’t abuse it. I myself love the term ‘rabble-rouser’ though.

  18. I guess I’m going to be the prude here. I can cuss a blue streak with the best of them, but since I have little kids at home, I’ve learned to be more creative with the way I express myself (most of the time). I think it shows class when someone refrains from using gratuitous coarse language. That being said, I know there are times, like the Pulp Fiction example, where substitutions just don’t cut it, so I personally would vote for using “bada$$” – it has that “pardon my French” connotation, which I appreciate.

  19. I vote for either Bad*ss or Bada$$.

    I guess you could say “Bad-arse”, but it doesn’t have quite the same ring to it!

  20. My minority vote is no, don’t use it, but it’s just a velleity (thanks William F. Buckley!) – I see it as a slippery slope thing. It won’t hurt any one but it’s just another step in the direction of vulgarity that really doesn’t need to be taken.

  21. Interesting arguments, I personally don’t think people who are very easily offended or unsupervised young children should be on an unrestricted internet. If they do venture on they should be prepared take their high morals in hand and remember not every one thinks like them, and for children there are programs parents can buy to protect the children from the internet as well as hardware.

    That being said I can’t help but poke some fun at the post. I read this site at work all the time (I don’t always have lots to do) I counted at least nine four letter words in that post
    How disgraceful! Now as I look at my own post I see I have falling in to using them as well. We have all been tainted. You should remove them i.e. like, site, soap.

    Ok the fun being poked to death, you should at least keep the site work safe. Some of us need something intelligent to do.

  22. my vote goes to “bad-arse” or “awesomely bad.”

  23. I think as family friendly as your magazine and site are, you don’t need to use it.

    For your title, why not:

    6 Tough Quakers

    or

    6 Quakers you wouldn’t want to meet in a dark alley

    or something like that…

    sko

  24. Doesn’t this really just open the door to the bada** m*****f*****?

    Just kidding, though. I’m not quite that squeamish – if you guys can stay PG-13, I think we’ll be doing okay :)

  25. You should use the term naughtyposterior.

  26. Ass seems to be the most innocuous of swear words. I hear it on tv and at work and it is rarely censored or commented upon. Personally though, I prefer a title such as: “Quakers: 6 BAMFs You Need To Know”. You might as well spice it up some if there’s gonna be a debate.

  27. Use it. After all, this is the internet where some of the most vile, disturbing things have ever been unleashed upon the general public. Badasss.

  28. The term “badass” probably derived it’s original meaning as a reference to a particularly ornery donkey. I don’t see it as profane at all.
    If “bad-arse” were used, as suggested by a commenter above, the meaning and intent is more clearly profane.
    Please continue to use “badass” on this site. The use of asterisks to disguise the word is also discouraged.

  29. At any rate, I appreciate the appropriate language used on this site. I like being able to forward things to my mother without worrying about it. And as others have pointed out, it is really unneccessary for effective communication–I doubt the use of a tamer word has hindered anyone’s comprehension of anything found on here!

  30. My opinion.
    Character substitution is an insult to intelligence and literacy. Say what you mean and mean what you say.

    How about The Dog’s Bollocks? instead of Badass.

  31. I’m pretty numb to profanity as well. However, I think that it would change my opinion of this site (less professional) to find prolific vulgarity. I wouldn’t have an issue with something being called badass, or bada$$ every once in a while when it’s necessary. I also agree with other posters who say that the difference between “badass” and “bada$$” is irrelevant for reading purposes. However, if it keeps you off of my blacklist at work, I’d go with “bada$$”

  32. As Bart Simpson pointed out once, “ass” is in the Bible. So it’s not a swear.

    I’ve always thought that a curse isn’t a curse unless you are:

    a.) using it against someone, or
    b.) in certain situations-among the elderly or children, in polite company, in school, etc.

    So you know, use your judgement. I have a small child at home also, so I’ve found myself becoming very creative. LOL

  33. How about… “he’s one mean donkey!”

    To quote another poster, “Samuel L. Jackson was one mean donkey in Pulp Fiction!”

    Frankly, I don’t care either way, but personally I always try to think up unique curses. “Ahhhh SUGAR!” instead of “Ahhhhh SH..!” is my personal favorite.

  34. I like just plain and simple BA…we all know it means badass, and you don’t have to use the asterisks. Don’t substitute for it though- you’re right in thinking that badass just has…a certain quality to it that hits the nail on the head every time.

  35. I agree with Ian, Jordan, Scott and Dan T. specifically, and all the people who said that the site would lose it’s intellectual flavor if it were splattered with words I look down my teacher nose at 6th graders for using.

    Come on, guys. Keep it grown-up around here. “6 Quakers you wouldn’t want to meet in a dark alley” is an amazing article title. Resorting to baby-fied ‘curse’ words is something I would expect from a lesser site, but a lesser site you are not.

  36. Either “badass” is allowed in its full glory or all versions of the word need to be stricken from the site. There is nothing badass about “bada**”, the term becomes self defeating in the safe form.

  37. “Should we be allowed to use the word badass in posts?”

    No.

  38. If the word is banned, does that mean we can’t use it in the office?

    I just heard that an older woman two floors up dove into the elevator to keep the doors from closing. She broke a rib but isn’t suing. She, my friend, is an agent provocateur.

  39. Definitely.
    Use it.
    Nothing you use in its place could truly encompass all that “badass” offers.

  40. Like Siljanna, I’d prefer as safe of a site as possible (or appropriate). I visit during work hours too, and would hate for this site to be ‘red-flagged’ on our server filters. I can’t imagine ‘badass’ would be a red flag, but it could lead to other words sneaking in. The 7 G.Carlin words come to mind (boy, it’s been years since I’ve heard that shtick.)

  41. I just think you guys are too smart (as are your readers) to require the use of badass. There is just something more formal in the written word then the causal conversation, where it’s not that big of a deal.

  42. (sigh)

    I was once in a leadership development program that spent an entire session on swear words (variants of damn–dammit, by damn, etc.), scatalogical terms (referring to bodily waste), profanity (which defames a religous icon or other object of veneration), and vulgarity (coarse but not necessarily profane, scatological or swear words).

    I’m not making this up. It was like a vacation in the Annex to the Fifth Circle of Hell.

    The entire subject gave me a f***ing headache.

  43. I vote YES for ‘badass’….how else would you describe Samuel L Jackson?

  44. I say use badass, or BAMF, which is not a swear word technically because it’s an acronym.

  45. Go ahead and use it! Both spellings of the word (with and without the *) have the intended impact for the sentence, so why not?

  46. I’m of the opinion that a word only has power if you give it power.

    Additionally, where there are so many expressive words in hte English language, why must we limit ourselves to using language that many would consider a curse/swear word?

    Having said all that, I’m going to vote to simply remove the vowels if we must use a “bad” word.

  47. I believe that both “badass” and “jackass” are acceptable non-swears.

    there is no good substitute for either, and they aren’t offensive. Jackass, maybe.

    use sparingly as directed.

  48. Use the word ‘wicked’… my 80’s generation of teens used that a lot to convey much the same meaning I think you’re after here.

    I’m in favor of using something other than ‘badass’ or a form substituting symbols for letters- words that are becoming more and more acceptable in standard English don’t always improve our image nor do they really add anything to what we’re saying.

    Count my vote in with #35 Sarah’s.

  49. Kind of amusing that later today you used badass in a post in describing Chuck Norris who endorses Huckabee. However, again, it would be as easy to say “tough guy Chuck Norris” instead.
    PS. Don’t count my vote twice as I already fell on the side of not using it and challenging yourself to work around it.

  50. Like many on here, I like that I can come to this site during work hours. Not to mention, since this is a site that challenges the mind, shouldn’t you have to challenge yourselves to find creative alternatives? Y’all have done an awesome job so far. I do believe, however, that it can be used sparingly (the Samuel L. Jackson example, for one).

  51. “There is just something more formal in the written word then the causal conversation, where it’s not that big of a deal.” Right on, #41 Liz.

    And please. Feel free to count my vote twice. I feel right enough about this issue to count for two.

    P.S. Count Scott twice, too. Ha.

  52. I think that you have 2 choices:

    1-Make the decision to use it and use it proudly without asterisks, or
    2-Make the decision not to use it at all.

    I guess the asterisks provide veiled comfort for the writer since s/he is not
    “technically” swearing, but for us readers, we read it all the same way.

    The readership of this blog/magazine is educated enough to know that, most of the time, creative vocab is often funnier and more appropriate than swearing. However, there are times when you have to use the words. “Tough guy” just doesn’t do it for me.

  53. Let’s say MF (shorthand for a swear itself) does an article on a robot that looks like Patrick Swayze, has laser eyes, is a black belt in kung fu and was built by Richard Dean Anderson out of leftover office supplies. What other word could possibly describe a structure of such sheer badassery?
    Besides, I think we’re all too smart here NOT to use the word badass. We’re not infants and words shouldn’t scare us so there’s no need to arbitrarily censor our language here.

  54. use badass

  55. Going on that “intelligent” route, I feel we’re all smart enough to discern when using badass is appropriate and justified, and when it’s just being simple-minded and lazy. I agree that the word does have a punch that “tough guy” doesn’t have. I honestly don’t feel that allowing this word will open up the floodgates for other words.

  56. Jerry, LMAO!!!

  57. It’s a legitimate term, with a special context all its own. When used to convey that unique tone, it is adds something useful to the language. It loses any saving grace of used generically or liberally, however.

    Replacing letters smacks of that artificial sensitivity that characterized the victorian era, or an attempt to elude spam filters or grammar bots. Needless distraction.

  58. I am not against cursing, per say. Sometimes I love to curse. But I work as a young adult/teens librarian so I don’t curse there. And I was involved in a PG-13 rated sketch comedy group where we didn’t curse at all, except for saying things like ‘eff’ or ‘d-bag.’ My dad found that last word really funny. So I don’t think you need to use the term Bada** when BA is totally fine.

  59. I’d prefer asterisks. I like to read this at work sometimes, and I would miss its ability to help me through the day if it got blocked by our filters.

  60. I feel using Chuck Norris name in place of the word BadA$$ is an acceptable replacement.

    The 6 Chuck Norris like Quakers you would like to know.

  61. Definitely use it. I consider it more of an adjective than a swear word.

  62. If you type the full word badass I will be overwhelmingly offended and will promptly stop reading your blog and tell all my friends not to.

    I’m being sarcastic; grow some balls and step on some toes.

  63. The minority report here. Don’t use it. The English language has a plethora of words to conjure an image in one’s mind. I’ve often thought that the usage of MF, BA, etc, shows a want of imagination. I direct you to Shakespeare’s insult generator for inspiration.

  64. For #30:
    Excellent moniker! I thought Snow Crash was a good read.

    However, I disagree with using the dog’s bollocks as a replacement for badass. Badass can mean either good (This cake is badass) or tough (Chuck Norris is badass), while the dog’s bollocks is limited to just good (Your Majesty, that dress is the dog’s bollocks).

    For others:
    While I lean towards the side of not using the word badass, I understand that sometimes it may be an appropriate descriptor (e.g. Chuck Norris, Samuel L. Jackson). I also believe that mental_floss is trying to cultivate a cool and trendy image as well as an intelligent one. All-in-all the readership and bloggers should be intelligent enough to know when it’s appropriate for use.

    Bottom line, if you can’t come up with a better descriptor, then just use the word badass. I doubt that most web servers would block a site containing the word… they’re more apt to block sites with IntelleTXT before that.

    That’s my long and wordy response.

  65. Seriously, I really prefer this site not use any profanity. It’s the foot in the doorway. So where, really, do you draw the line? I do enjoy reading this blog every day. Profanity laced blogs are removed from my favorites.

  66. Seriously, “tough guy” reeks of corny-ness.

    I do agree with another post, though. This website is my only link to sanity in my terrifically mind-numbing job. The removal of asterisks will probably redflag it, and I’ll be back to leaving “scatalogical references” of my co-workers on whispered voicemails to my friends who got out.

  67. When we censor or ban swearwords, people just come up with proxies, which eventually become swears in their own right. So really there’s little point to censoring a swearword, and I doubt there are many people who can boast never having let a swear pass their lips.

    I think the real problem is when every other word passing one’s lips is a swear. Like all earthly ‘vices,’ moderation is key. I think I can trust this blog to use common sense.

  68. It’s a great word! Use it as often as needed!

  69. WHAT COUNTRY DO YOU THINK THIS IS!?! Say whatever you want to whomever you want. (jackass)

  70. Le mot juste: Badass.

  71. If Disney can use it (I see a badass mother, who don’t take no crap from nobody! — Cool Runnings), then I don’t see why you can’t.

  72. I have no problem with that particular word as long as this doesnt turn into a profanity laced site.

    My only concern, as stated by a lot of people above, is that I read this at work and I dont know how I would fill some days if it was blocked. I guess you can use BA to keep this work-friendly.

  73. I have no problem with it–go ahead and use it! Sometimes there’s no use substituting.

    I also can’t stand it when asterisks or other symbols are used to substitute for letters. We all know what you’re saying–just say it!

  74. I personally could care less.

    Having said that, and realizing that not everyone will see it that way, I would say allow it in situations where there is no suitable alternative (such as anything regarding Samuel L Jackson).

    My boss is pretty squeamish about this stuff, so I try to censor myself whenever he’s in earshot. My personal rule is: if it’s ok for network TV, it’s ok for work (and should also be ok for this site).

  75. I recently saw an article called The Nine Most Badass Bible Verses, and you know what? It worked. It was funny, but perfectly descriptive of the subject at hand. Badass is a great word, derived from an impactful culture and is, IMHO, a standalone word.

  76. Oh, man. Badass is far removed from offensive – it’s not even negative! If you have to censor in some way for the people at work, use BA. The others are incredibly annoying. [As stated, if the word is highly offensive to someone, the astericks won't keep it from bothering them.]

    However, if you’re not badass enough to use the word, I like Don’s idea – let’s make Chuck Norris an adjective. Norrisian. Or, for that matter, Jacksonian. [Of course, the definition of either of those would, in fact, be badass, so it's a simple dodge of the problem.]

    I’m from Jackson, so I’m all for Jacksonian meaning badass. :D

  77. So here’s the thing… when I first read the title to this post, I was like bada (bah-dah) what? Either it is the end of a long day or I am just so badassed that I would never see it as an offensive word.

    badabing…keep it in.

  78. whats so bad about a bad donkey?
    yup i’m a brit ;)

  79. With all this debate about badass, I guess my idea for a substitute title is out:

    “6 Bitchin’ Quakers you need to know.”

    But seriously, it all comes down to the fact of how you guys want to be percieved or, in other words, what kind of rating you would want: G, PG, or PG-13. (I’m guessing that since where debating something that most wouldn’t even consider a swear word, R is right out).

    But after you make that descision, stick to your guns. Don’t do the asterick thing, ’cause that’s just silly. Everyone knows what you mean, once they translate it and realize that it’s not something to do with badabing.

    Hell, for me personally, I wouldn’t care if you guys used some other badass words. (Now there’s an idea for an article: A Brief History of Badass Words)

  80. Badass has been used so much, it’s role as a swear word has been played out. I say keep it.

  81. Last I checked, ass is hardly a swear. I mean seriously, there are third graders who use it. After all, as ass is merely referring to a donkey, not something more vulgar or insulting.

    And badass should be considered even less of an obscene word, as it does not even have negative connotations.

  82. Just say “forkin’ awesome,” like I do.

  83. I say keep the word as is. After all, the other options just don’t seem as badass.

    Alternative: rudebottom

  84. I think that it either should be uncensored or nonexistant. Except in the case of Quakers specifically, in which case it is kind of suiting to censor yourself. Otherwise, all or none.

  85. I enjoy the over cleanliness of the site. It forces you all to maintain your clever and wit. However, if it is just badass (or even one or two others) I think that level of lightness and fun can remain.

    I vote badass.

  86. “B.A.” was good enough for B.A. Baracus and it’s good enough for me.

  87. Use it. Don’t use. I don’t care, but can you get on with the story about the Quakers?

  88. I personally find your site refreshing for it’s lack of vulgar language/content. As someone before me mentioned, it’s a slippery slope, and I for one, don’t want Mental Floss to go in that direction. So, my vote is NO, please don’t use it!

  89. Just use badass. No one has come up with a comparable synonym. And, using asterisks is completely lame.

  90. I am interested in how this was resolved. Anyway, I came to this site because I was looking for a synonym for badass, and I was not disappointed by your readers. I’ve got enough to last me for a while–”awesomely bad” being one of my favorites.

    (just in case your wondering: I’m working on a profanity filter)

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