11 Secrets of Butterball's Turkey Talk-Line Operators

Butterball
Butterball

Butterball’s Turkey Talk-Line started small. Their first holiday season in 1981, a team of six home economists answered 11,000 turkey-related questions from cooks across America. Things have grown a great deal since then: More than 50 phone operators now work out of the Butterball office in Naperville, Illinois—about a 30-minute drive from Chicago—and they answer 10,000 calls on Thanksgiving day alone. That’s not to mention all the texts, emails, and instant chat messages they also handle.

We spoke to three talk-line operators to find out what it takes to become a turkey expert and why they give up their own holidays to help others avoid disastrous dinners.

1. THEY NEED AT LEAST A FOUR-YEAR DEGREE IN A FOOD-RELATED FIELD.

The talk-line operators don’t call themselves “experts” for nothing. To be considered for the job, they need to have completed at least four years of a food-related program. Turkey talk-line supervisors Janice Stahl and Carol Miller both have degrees in home economics. Nicole Johnson, a talk-line coordinator, has degrees in nutrition dietetics and public health. There are also lots of registered dieticians on staff, and some of the other employees have worked as chefs or food stylists.

2. CONNECTIONS HELP WHEN IT COMES TO GETTING HIRED.

Positions on the talk-line are never formally advertised—only by word of mouth—so it helps to know someone who works there. Stahl says she found out about the job from her mother-in-law, who worked as a talk-line operator for more than 10 years. “It kind of takes a little bit of a connection to get in,” she says. “It’s a hot little commodity job.” In a similar vein, Miller found out about the job from a neighbor, and Johnson learned about it from a former teacher.

3. THE OPERATORS HAVE STAYING POWER.

Once someone does land a job, they tend to stick around a while. Many of Butterball's turkey experts have worked at the talk-line for over 10 years. "It's not a job where people really leave," Stahl told Patch in 2015. "We may hire one person a year."

4. NEW TRAINEES HAVE TO COMPLETE “BUTTERBALL UNIVERSITY.”

"Then and now" photos of Butterball's kitchen
Butterball

During their first three years on the talk-line, all Butterball “freshmen” have to complete a one-day training seminar, dubbed Butterball University, at the start of each season. They’re assigned a specific method of turkey preparation, and spend the day cooking in the Butterball office kitchen. Butterball U attendees have tested out every possible appliance, from deep fryers to charcoal grills to sous vides.

“At the end of the day we’re looking at 10 or 12 turkeys that have been cooked in all these different methods,” Miller says. “Then we compare the appearance of the turkey, we compare time, we compare the juices that are in the bottom of the pan—Is there a lot of juice? Is it brown juice?” That way, “when the phones start ringing or the texts come in, you have actually visualized it," she says.

All of the experts also have to complete “advanced training” each year, which covers Butterball’s products and provides a refresher course on how to operate the phone and computer systems. (The computers are used to keep a record of the type of questions received, which are sometimes discussed in future training sessions.) New this year is a system that allows callers to hang up and have an operator call them back, instead of being put on hold. The wait can be short or long, depending on how many callers they have that day, and how chatty they are. "Sometimes the call will vary from 30 or 45 seconds to 30 to 45 minutes," Johnson says.

5. THEY HEAR ALL KINDS OF CONFESSIONS.

Because the talk-line operators are so sweet, affable, and non-judgmental, many callers feel comfortable telling them all kinds of personal details. “We are kind of like a confession hotline,” Stahl says. “We’ll get the husband on one line and the wife on the other because there’s been a dispute about what temperature the oven should be.”

One year, a new bride called into the hotline in a panic. She was nervous about cooking for her in-laws and couldn’t tell whether the turkey was done. They could barely hear her whispering into the phone, and when they asked her why she was speaking so softly, she replied, “I’m in the hallway closet.”

Another time, a man wanted to propose to his girlfriend by placing a ring inside the turkey, then cooking it. Miller, who took that call, advised him against it. "At the time I was worried about food safety and the romantic moment! Crunching down on a diamond—either big or small—could have been a problem for the bride or whoever found the ring," she explains. “I convinced him it would be just as dramatic if he took the ring, got a piece of ribbon, and tied it on a drumstick and then brought the turkey into the gathering and proposed that way.” This happened in the mid-’80s, and Miller still wonders what happened to them, and whether the woman said yes. “By now they could have kids and grandkids, and I can just imagine grandpa telling that story.”

6. THEY SHARE THEIR TURKEY MISTAKES WITH CALLERS.

Two talk-line hosts are shown answering calls at their desks in 1988
Butterball

Some of the talk-line operators have had a few turkey mishaps of their own, and they'll share these personal stories with callers to let them know they’re not alone. “We’re all human. Everybody knows somebody that’s left that little treasure bag in the wishbone cavity of the turkey,” Miller says.

One time, Miller had an extra-large turkey but didn’t have a suitable pan to hold it, so she used a cookie sheet instead. “That was not a good idea because I spent I don’t know how much time bailing [the juices] out of the cookie sheet so that it wouldn’t go out and over the pan and into the oven,” she says. Another time, she “burned the heck out of a turkey” on a charcoal grill.

Stahl has a similar story. Once, after moving into a new home, she bought a turkey before checking to see if the oven worked. It didn’t, as she discovered on Thanksgiving day. So they ordered pizza instead.

7. THEIR CALLERS TRY TO THAW TURKEYS IN SOME PRETTY STRANGE PLACES.

Pools, bathtubs, dishwashers, jacuzzis—all have been used in attempts to thaw turkeys. One dad was bathing his twin kids and decided to put the turkey in the tub with them. Another family was having a large reunion at a hotel, and plopped 10 turkeys into the bathtub to thaw. “Picture the maid coming in and seeing that,” Miller says.

Turkeys have also been stored in some creative places when freezer space is lacking. Operators have heard from callers who left their turkeys in the trunk, only to discover that the weather warmed up the next day and ruined them. In states where it starts snowing in November, it’s not unusual for people to leave their turkeys outside in a snowbank. One year, someone did this and called into the hotline because they wanted to know how to find it. “The Midwest stories are the best,” Stahl says.

8. THEY CAN TELL YOU HOW TO MICROWAVE A TURKEY.

Butterball’s talk-line operators are trained in all methods of turkey preparation, including microwaves. After all, things go wrong and ovens stop functioning, so they need to be capable of guiding callers through the next-best-case scenario. In 2005, they got tons of calls from people living in FEMA trailers after Hurricane Katrina destroyed their homes. The shelters had microwaves but no ovens, and they wanted to know whether they could still cook a proper Thanksgiving meal.

“You can do it, but it’s gotta be about 12 pounds or less,” Stahl says. “You can even stuff it, stick it in the microwave, and we can walk you through all the steps. It works and it actually tastes really good. You wouldn’t know the difference.” The presentation, however, isn’t as nice as a turkey cooked in an oven. “It’s not pretty when it comes out of the microwave. That’s the only thing,” Stahl says.

9. THEY GET ASKED TURKEY-RELATED QUESTIONS EVEN WHEN THEY'RE OFF-DUTY.

While many of the turkey experts proudly wear a jacket with Butterball’s Talk-Line logo on the left side, they also know the risks. Namely, if they’re going to be leaving the house while wearing it, they should ensure they have plenty of time to talk turkey. “If you ask everybody in [Butterball’s office] on Thanksgiving day if they’ve ever been stopped somewhere out of the house with their Butterball jacket on and asked a question, I’m sure they all would say yes,” Miller says. She’s been stopped at the library, at soccer games, at Home Depot, and at the grocery store, so she always has to be on top of her game.

Stahl says she was at the grocery store when “some lady came after me in aisle three.” The woman didn’t know how to cook a turkey or even which aisle carried them, so Stahl sat down with her at a coffee shop inside the store and explained how it’s done—from start to finish. She didn’t mind helping, but conceded, “A grocery store is never where you want to wear a Butterball coat.”

10. THEY UNSUCCESSFULLY PETITIONED FOR A THANKSGIVING TURKEY EMOJI.

Butterball’s turkey experts launched a change.org petition last year to get Unicode, the leading authority on emojis, to introduce a cooked turkey icon. When responding to questions by text, the turkey experts sometimes throw in an emoji to make it more friendly and festive. However, they weren’t satisfied with the live turkey emoji because, as Butterball’s longest-standing talk-line operator Marge Klindera explained in a promotional video, “If your turkey looked like this, even we can’t help you.” Unfortunately, support was somewhat lacking—they got a little over 7500 signatures—and they never received their Thanksgiving emoji. “I think it might take a couple years to get the emoji,” Johnson says.

11. THEY DELAY THEIR OWN THANKSGIVING TO HELP YOU "HOST LIKE A BOSS."

Butterball’s turkey experts are scheduled to work from 6 a.m. to 6 p.m. on Thanksgiving day (and from 8 a.m. to 2 p.m. on Christmas Eve), which means they have no choice but to delay their own holiday celebrations. When it’s time for lunch, they order soup to help soothe their throats, since their voices are often hoarse by the end of the day. They don’t seem to mind one bit, though.

“All of us love to do this, and the really funny thing that people are kind of surprised to hear is that we actually all love to be there on Thanksgiving day because that’s the day when people need the most help,” Stahl says. “Those are the panicked calls that come in, like ‘I have a frozen turkey and it’s Thanksgiving morning. What am I going to do?’”

The rewarding nature of the job and the countless human connections they’ve formed are why so many talk-line operators keep coming back year after year. Johnson says the job is “exhausting in one way, but you still feel really good” for having helped save people from “turkey trauma.” So if you have a burning question about your forthcoming turkey feast, go ahead and give them a ring at 1-800-BUTTERBALL. They’d be happy to help.

15 Secrets of Sesame Street Puppeteers

Abby Cadabby, Suki Lopez, and Elmo (L-R) on Sesame Street
Abby Cadabby, Suki Lopez, and Elmo (L-R) on Sesame Street
HBO

For 50 years and more than 4500 episodes, Sesame Street has been imparting valuable moral, ethical, and social lessons to young audiences using a sprawling cast of puppets. The Sesame characters—Big Bird, Elmo, Oscar the Grouch, Cookie Monster, Bert and Ernie, the Count, and others—have become instantly recognizable to generations of viewers. But behind every memorable character is a human performer, one tasked with juggling the technical demands of puppet operation without losing the humor and heart that makes their furry counterpart so memorable.

To get a better sense of what goes into this unique skill set, Mental Floss spoke with three veteran Sesame Street performers during the show’s semicentennial celebration. Here’s what they had to say about crossed puppet eyes, grooming habits, and enjoying a long career finessing felt.

1. Sesame Street puppeteers usually get started lending a (right) hand.

Though there’s no definitive set of directions for puppeteers to get to Sesame Street, a number of performers selected to work on the show begin as apprentices with one specific task: operating the right hand of characters alongside the veteran cast members. “A lot of performers will almost only do right hands for a very long time,” Ryan Dillon, the puppeteer behind Elmo, tells Mental Floss. “Some characters, like Cookie Monster, require two performers with two practical hands.”

Dillon started working on Sesame Street in 2005 at the age of 17. He performed as a right hand and as supporting characters for years before scoring the Elmo role in 2013. Throughout that training, he accompanied the main puppeteer, who uses their dominant (usually right) hand to control the mouth and the other to control the left hand. The newcomer will manipulate the right, a duty informally known as right handing. “It’s a great training ground,” Dillon says. “You’re working directly next to a performer with years of experience. You become one character together.”

2. Sesame Street puppeteers have tricks for making their characters emote.

Abby Cadabby, Elmo, and Big Bird (L-R) appear in a scene from 'Sesame Street'
(L-R) Abby Cadabby, Elmo, and Big Bird delve into fine art.
HBO

Peter Linz, who portrays Ernie (among other characters) on the series, tells Mental Floss that getting a puppet to exhibit a personality takes some finessing. “You have to show the entire range of human emotion through something that doesn’t have an expression,” he says. Linz, who also teaches classes on puppeteering, says that there are some techniques to get puppets to show off their mood, however. “You can make them look sad by having them look down. You can get them to smile by opening their mouth. If they’re angry, maybe you close their mouth and then shake their arms ever so slightly. There are degrees of subtlety in all of that.”

Linz says the audience does part of that work themselves, projecting their own feelings onto a puppet. The ultimate proof might be in the example of Miss Piggy. While not a Sesame Street cast member, Linz says it’s telling that people often seem to believe the vivacious and flirtatious porcine character bats her eyes. “She can’t,” he says. The puppet doesn’t have that ability.

3. Not all Sesame Street puppets can perform the same tasks.

Sesame Street utilizes three major varieties of character. There’s the full-body puppet, like Big Bird and Snuffleupagus; “bag” puppets with two articulated hands, like Cookie Monster; and hand-and-rod puppets that have arms controlled by thin rods. “Elmo is a hand-and-rod puppet,” Dillon says. “[The difference means] some puppets can do things others can’t. Cookie Monster can pick things up. Elmo can, but it takes longer. You need to stop [filming] and attach something to his hands with tape or a pin.”

4. Sesame Street puppeteers rely on a key design element to connect to their audience.

Grover, Oscar the Grouch, and Elmo from 'Sesame Street' are pictured
Grover, Oscar the Grouch, and Elmo.
Zack Hyman/HBO

It can be difficult to communicate that a puppet is able to focus a pair of fixed eyes on something, whether it’s another character, an object, or the audience. But Linz says that the Sesame Street crew and the rest of the Muppets were designed by Henson with that in mind. “The eyes are just two black dots against a white background,” he says. “But all the characters are ever so slightly cross-eyed. There’s a triangle between the eyes and nose and a point where it looks like they’re looking right into the camera.” It’s a sensitive illusion. Turning the puppet even slightly, he says, and they will wind up looking at something else.

5. Sesame Street puppeteers can spend their entire day crouched on the floor.

Being a Sesame Street puppeteer requires more than just having performing chops. On set, characters that may be at waist level with their human co-stars are operated by performers crouched below frame, often on wheeled boards called rollies. “The first day or two, your back and everything else is sore,” Dillon says. “It engages your whole body. Your arm is up in the air performing.” Some actors, Dillon says, have developed knee issues as a result of a career bent over. Fortunately, not every scene requires contortions. Some sets are built raised so performers can stand up straight. Other times, they’ll have to situate themselves horizontally. Scenes set on a stoop usually mean the performer is lying down behind the steps.

6. Sesame Street puppeteers have input into character design.

Elmo, Abby Cadabby, and Rosita (L-R) pose with fans of 'Sesame Street'
(L-R) Elmo, Abby Cadabby, and Rosita pose with fans.
Zack Hyman/HBO

Lurking in the offices of Sesame Workshop is a puppet factory that, according to Dillon, houses a number of "Anything Muppets"—blank designs that may one day be used as the template for a brand-new character. In 1991, performer Carmen Osbahr got an opportunity to get in on the ground floor of conceptualizing a character when she helped originate Rosita (top right), the first regular bilingual Muppet on the series. “They had a meeting and asked what I had in mind,” Osbahr tells Mental Floss. “I was able to tell them I wanted a monster and I wanted live hands because I wanted to be able to play a musical instrument. I wanted her to be active and colorful. I didn’t want a petite, tiny little monster.” Both Osahr and Rosita have been a presence on the show ever since.

7. Sesame Street puppeteers have material for a blooper reel, but you’ll probably never see it.

Puppet manipulation takes concentration and effort. Occasionally, the cast of Sesame Street can find themselves flubbing a take. According to Osbahr, that’s often due to trying to coordinate left and right hands. “The main thing is props,” she says. “Grabbing stuff is easy, but if you want to pour something into a cup or write a letter, that’s hard. You think you’ll have a glass but just miss it.” Performers can also fall off their rollies, sending their counterparts tumbling out of the frame.

8. Each Sesame Street character has a dedicated puppeteer—with a couple of exceptions.

Actress Amanda Seyfried (L) appears on 'Sesame Street' with Abby Cadabby
Actress Amanda Seyfried with Abby Cadabby.
Richard Termine/HBO

When it comes to Sesame Street characters, there is one sacrosanct rule—aside from right handing, no puppet will have more than one puppeteer. “We feel strongly each Muppet has a dedicated performer,” Dillon says. “If there were two or three Elmos, you would see a copy of a copy.” However, illnesses or personal appearances can make that rule difficult to follow every time. If Dillon can’t make a shoot, a performer will step in to operate the puppet, with Dillon going in to provide the voice later.

The cast can also cover for one another if a scene requires two characters who are normally operated by the same actor. Both Bert and Grover, for example, are played by actor Eric Jacobson. If the two share screen time, Dillon might step in to perform one of them, with Jacobson recording his lines later.

9. Sesame Street puppeteers have a specific way of handling their puppets to keep them clean.

Day after day of manipulating puppets can lead to issues with cleanliness. Performer sweat can dampen the foam insides, while body oils and other contaminants can affect their fur coats. To avoid being dirtied, Linz says performers and production members try to pick up the puppets by the scruff of their necks. “We don’t want to put our oily hands on their faces,” Linz says. Puppets are also usually delivered to and from the set by a team of “Muppet wranglers,” and stored in the workshop where they’re built and maintained. To dry out a puppet, they’re sometimes placed on a wooden stand. A hair dryer set on low might also be used to dry a sweaty interior.

10. Sesame Street puppeteers work very, very closely together.

The characters from 'Sesame Street' are pictured
The puppet cast of Sesame Street.
HBO

Owing to the frequent proximity of puppets in frame, Sesame Street puppeteers are usually working near or virtually over other performers. “We try to be very aware and conscious of the people around us,” Dillon says. “Mistakes happen. Elmo has big feet, and Abby Cadabby has big feet, so you’ll often hit the other person with a foot. It doesn’t hurt.”

11. Guest stars will talk directly to Sesame Street characters—not just the puppeteers.

Sesame Street has played host to many guest stars over the decades, from actors to First Lady Michelle Obama. According to Osbahr, their human guests will often address the character even off-camera. “Most everybody who visits us talks to the character like they’re alive,” she says. “The moment we bring a character down [to rest], we have a conversation, but it’s great to have a relationship with a character and a celebrity. They’ll talk to Elmo, Rosita, Cookie Monster, and we’re talking to them right back.”

12. Sesame Street puppeteers can take years to get fully comfortable with a character.

Actress Blake Lively (L) poses with Cookie Monster on the set of 'Sesame Street'
Actress Blake Lively (L) poses with Cookie Monster.
Zack Hyman/HBO

For many performers, it can take years before they feel like they’re fully inhabiting their character. “You can be so focused on doing something right, you forget to have fun with the character,” Osbahr says. “By the fourth season, that’s when I started letting go, taking risks, having fun. You stop having to think about it.”

Fortunately, it’s not uncommon for performers on Sesame Street to spend decades on the show, which means there's plenty of time to adjust. Carol Spinney, who portrayed Big Bird and Oscar the Grouch, retired in 2018 after 49 years as a cast member. Osbahr says the familial atmosphere encourages longevity. “I’ve been with this group of people for 30 years,” she says. “We’ve shared a lot of incredible memories together.”

13. Sesame Street puppeteers can sometimes mourn a puppet who is declared “toast.”

Made of foam and other delicate materials, Sesame Street puppets have a shelf life. Depending on use, wear, and handling, they might last a few years before needing to be replaced. Linz says two new Ernies have recently been made after one began sloughing off foam inside, a symptom the production calls “toast” because the foam resembles toast crumbs.

Even with replacements, the legacy of characters can still live on. Linz uses an Ernie with the same mouth plate that was used by Jim Henson as far back as 1982.

14. Sesame Street puppeteers have to work backward.

Actor Anthony Mackie appears on 'Sesame Street' with Cookie Monster
Actor Anthony Mackie with Cookie Monster.
Jesse Grant/HBO

The most surprising aspect of working as a Sesame Street puppeteer? According to Linz, it’s the fact that performers often have to essentially work backwards. Because they’re crouched below the camera frame, puppeteers need to watch a monitor placed low to the ground to see what the camera sees. “When you move your arm to the right, the arm on the monitor moves to the left,” he says. “You’re seeing the image the audience sees.”

15. Yes, Sesame Street puppets are technically Muppets.

Sometimes there's confusion over whether the puppets that appear on Sesame Street actually constitute Muppets, or whether that term is reserved for non-Sesame projects like The Muppet Show or other endeavors featuring Kermit, Miss Piggy, and the others. According to Dillon, any Henson-birthed or -inspired puppet is a Muppet. “It’s become a catch-all term for puppets,” he says. “It’s a brand name, like Kleenex. Jim Henson came up with the name. A Muppet is used for characters that he came up with."

10 Secrets of Victoria’s Secret Employees

A Victoria's Secret retail store in an airport mall
A Victoria's Secret retail store in an airport mall
studioportosabbia/iStock via Getty Images

Victoria’s Secret was born out of an awkward shopping experience. Roy Raymond didn’t feel comfortable browsing for underwear for his wife at a department store, and he wanted to create a more upscale lingerie destination that was welcoming to both men and women. The first Victoria’s Secret location opened in Palo Alto, California, in 1977.

In the 40-plus years since, Victoria’s Secret has changed the fashion industry, launched the careers of supermodels, and made shopping for bras slightly less awkward for the people who don’t wear them. Behind the company’s success are the sales associates responsible for keeping panties neatly folded and finding customers bras that fit correctly. Employees may confess they don't really know what Victoria’s secret is, but they can tell you how to get them to let you shop in peace, where to go if they don’t have your size, and more insider information. We spoke with a couple of former employees to discover their most revealing insights.

1. Victoria’s Secret employees are trained to fit all body types.

The clientele of Victoria’s Secret is diverse, and employees are trained to help every person who comes into the store find a bra that fits them. According to Andrea, who worked at Victoria's Secret from 2015 to 2019, bra fitting specialists undergo about six weeks of training to prepare for almost every possible scenario.

“Whether you’re somebody who’s had a mastectomy, or somebody who’s transitioning, or somebody who’s getting a bra for the first time, that’s what we’re there for and that’s why we do our jobs,” she tells Mental Floss. “Let’s say you have somebody who had a mastectomy. You always measure for the breast that is there. That even goes for people who have uneven breasts. So if one breast is a B-cup and the other is a C-cup, we always measure to the C-cup. Also, if you’ve just had your breasts done, like a breast lift or implants, we would measure differently for that too because the bras are going to sit differently on your chest [compared to typical fitting]."

2. Victoria’s Secret employees are allowed to suggest other stores.

There are some scenarios where the only option employees have is to admit they can’t help a customer. Victoria’s Secret only carries sizes 30A to 40DDD, and if someone comes in looking for a bigger size than what’s available, associates are allowed to send them elsewhere. Andrea says she would recommend Torrid or Soma to people in need of larger bras. “We did give other bra places business because we feel like everyone should feel good in their bra, even if it doesn’t come from us," she says.

3. At least in the past, being conventionally attractive helped you get hired at Victoria’s Secret.

The Victoria’s Secret image is synonymous with ultra-thin supermodels strutting down a runway in lingerie and high heels. The company has struggled with sales in recent years, and some industry experts blame that in part on the brand’s limited view of what's considered “sexy." Victoria’s Secret is trying to combat this by experimenting with marketing featuring more diverse body types, but when Rita (not her real name) worked there roughly a decade ago, the old beauty standards were still enforced. The former sales associate tells Mental Floss, “They would hire someone pretty over someone smart or capable. It was definitely part of the ‘fantasy.’”

4. If you're shopping for your partner, Victoria's Secret employees might recommend something other than lingerie.

When people come into Victoria’s Secret looking for a gift for their romantic partner, they rarely have all the information they need. “For boyfriends, they usually never know their girlfriend’s size. Like, ever,” Andrea says.

Even a professional bra fitting specialist can’t guess someone’s exact size based on sight alone. That’s why employees might recommend skipping the intimates altogether and considering alternative gifts if you’re shopping for someone else at Victoria’s Secret. “For dudes shopping for their ladies, unless you know for a fact what their size is, do not buy them lingerie,” Rita says. She suggests gift cards, lotions, and body sprays as safer options. And if you’re absolutely set on getting your significant other something they can wear, Andrea recommends panties and bralettes, which tend to be more forgiving in the size department than underwire garments.

5. The people who work at Victoria’s Secret see more than they want to.

Employees at the chain want their customers to feel comfortable, but in some cases, guests can get too comfortable. Rita recalls a woman who shared a little too much when shopping for intimate wear. “She'd just reconnected with her high school sweetheart—she was probably in her forties/fifties—and she made a point to mention her recent boob job. Then all of a sudden she basically flashes me in the front of the store. ... It was definitely not a normal customer interaction.”

Some stories of unusual customer behavior are not for the squeamish. Andrea recounts one such example: “I had a woman come up to me and say, ‘Do you have a cup?’ And I was like ‘No ma’am, I’m sorry, I don’t have a cup. What do you need it for?’" The woman replied that she really needed to urinate. "And I was like, ‘Ma’am!’”

On a different occasion, a customer of Andrea's found a creative use for one of the pink bows used to decorate the bras. “She takes it and she flossed her teeth with it in front of me. I was like ‘No!’ It’s so gross.”

6. Victoria’s Secret employees get sweet perks.

If they’re willing to deal with the occasional gross encounter, Victoria’s Secret employees can take advantage of benefits many retail workers don’t get. One of them is paid time off. “Even though I was only a part-time associate, because I worked so many hours, they did give me paid time off,” Andrea says. “Most places I’ve worked for, you only get paid time off if you’ve been there for a year or are a full-time associate, so being a part-time associate and being able to have paid time off without being there for a year is really rare and something that we really appreciated as associates.”

The pay is also competitive compared to similar businesses. According to Andrea, “Victoria’s Secret has a yearly raise, and I went from making $11.50 to $22.14 when I left [after four years].”

7. The holidays at Victoria’s Secret are as crazy as you’d expect.

Victoria’s Secret has been known to ring in the holiday season with deals designed to lure customers into stores. For shoppers, this means cheap bras, but for associates, it means congestion, disorganized displays, and the rare scuffle. “Holiday time is crazy,” Andrea says. “I’ve literally seen grandmas punch each other in the face.”

8. There’s a trick to getting Victoria’s Secret employees to leave you alone.

To shy shoppers, or those just craving a bit of peace, there are no worse words in the English language than “What brings you in today?” If the thought of getting this question from a Victoria’s Secret employee fills you with dread, know that it isn’t their goal to harass you. “It’s not that we want to bother you, that’s what we’re supposed to do,” Andrea says. “And most likely we don’t want to come up to you as much as you don’t want us to come up.”

But if you ever do get over-eager sales associates, Andrea has an insider’s tip for getting them off your back. “A good trick if you don’t want help is to remember the name of the person who you’re introduced to. So if the first person is like ‘Hi, my name is Stephanie,’ and then two or three more people come and say ‘Do you need more help?’ just say ‘Stephanie’s helping me, thank you,’ and they will leave you alone.”

9. Victoria’s Secret smells like body spray for a reason.

If you’d rather shop for lingerie without walking through a cloud of perfume, too bad: Spritzing the store with the brand’s latest scent is part of the job for sales associates. Rita says, “If we were working the front rooms, we had to wear ‘beauty belts’ with the latest body spray in them to spray around the room (cue the headache) and carry around the newest bra." And in case the constant spraying wasn’t aggressive enough already, Rita was also instructed to pitch it to customers—along with apparel and the Victoria’s Secret credit card. “We basically had to accost anyone who walked in with ‘Have you seen the new bra? Have you smelled the new perfume? Do you have the angel card? Why not? Don't you want exclusive offers? Blah blah blah blah,’ and it scared a lot of people off.”

10. Victoria’s Secrets ends up with items it can’t sell.

Victoria’s Secret has a generous policy when it comes to returns: Stores offer a full refund for items brought back within 90 days of purchase as long as you have a receipt (without a receipt, the policy may vary). According to Rita, some customers take advantage of this policy by bringing back garments that are clearly not fit to be resold. “People will try to return anything, claiming they just bought it last week and it ‘just didn't work out’ when it's clearly not a bra we even carry anymore and it's super worn and gross.”

Some customers ruin clothing without buying it first. “The worst part was having to damage out [retail slang for swapping out an irreparable item] underwear that girls had tried on without leaving their own underwear on," Rita says. "Happened all the time. It was absolutely disgusting.”

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